Status
Not open for further replies.

babyboy808

Member
Begging for links eh :) - your site isn't even live my friend, what the ... ?
 

Byron

New Member
My god, there's a lot about
Paedophiles

(Sorry had to do that), on your site, it would discourage young people from using the internet, 10-40 year olds make up most of the internets users, although I do acknowledge there's a problem, it would not be beneficial to business.

Keep in mind Dan Le Sac

"Thou shalt not think any male over the age of 30 that plays with a child that is not their own is a peadophile, some people are just nice."
Dan Le Sac - Thou Shalt Always Kill Lyrics
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
hmmm.... I'm actually stunned into silence here from those comments... not really sure what you guys are trying to say...

As we all know there are a lot of "wrong-uns" just waiting on the net for vulnerable children. We also know that a lot of parents are completely web-illiterate and just let their kids online without any supervision or education as to responsable use.

www.LemurLoops.com is there purely to help parents get a handle on what their kids are upto and maybe if we can keep just one kid safe from some kind of paedo, then it will be worth it - dont you agree?

Also, in case no-one realises or just can't believe it, "Grooming" is still a LEGAL activity in Ireland because it has taken our lawmakers the guts of 6 years to come up with agreeable wording on the definition of grooming but we are told (By the the Dept of Justice) that they are nearing agreement and it should be in law within 2 years.

At present, it is ok for any adult to Groom a child online, talk explicitly, send "images", totally violate an innocent kid's mind and it is totally within the law, an offence only occurs if the "groomer" actually meets the victim - by then it could be way too late.

At LemurLoops we have included a petition for a law to be fast-tracked which we aim to deliver to the relevant ministers when we have enough signatures - please feel free to sign - also visit the blog and leave a comment or write an article and send it in

Regards
 

Byron

New Member
I would tend to agree with Blacknight, I know there is an issue, as do all the members here, and we gladly put links on relevant sites such as Hotline.ie . I just don't think the amount of scaremongering is required. Showing profiles and pictures of convicted Paedophiles won't promote safe use of the internet, rather stop parents from allowing their children near a website at all.

Myspace is not to be feared, besides children are not meant to use these sites.

I would suggest you pair with Hotline.ie - I fully support what they do, the last thing I want a potential site user doing is learning that the internet is awash with Paedophiles, even if it is, I want them to be aware of it and take action without fearing that around every corner their could be one.

It's a bit little like saying "Dublin has a litter problem, report problem areas here", rather than "Dublin is full of rubbish, here is a picture of a pile of it in a Duck pond" - it's too emotive if you are trying to campaign an issue without frightening people.
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
interesting

thank you for your comments which are duly noted, however - soft advice sites such as childline, barnados, thinkyouknow, webwise etc etc etc are fine, they all give friendly advice to parents and children which is great and much needed. What I would say to you though is "how many parents actually read them?" Do a small survey to a few parents you know and you'll be amazed at the replies. I would be very surprised at how many said yes they do read the advice and pass it on to their children. In my own daughter's school, they have never broached the subject of internet safety - amazing huh?

Hotline is a different kind of site entirely. It's main function is a process of reporting sites, not individuals. In our research for www.LemurLoops.com we found tons of pro-paedo sites thet we reported to both hotline and a detective in Harcourt St. We didn't even get an acknowledgement from Hotline and no further progress reports from either - the sites are still live.

The primary tactic of www.LemurLoops.com is indeed scare tactics. I felt we needed to wake people up to what's going on online and if a gallery of paedophiles along with their crimes can wake up just one parent and their child remains safe, then it is a good day's work.

The whole point behind www.lemurloops.com is also to speed up the process of making "grooming" a crime in Ireland by way of a petition. The official reason it's not a crime in Ireland is because the lawmakers of this country are yet to define "grooming" - how rediculous is that? At present, it is perfectly legal for a paedophile to talk online with potential victims, to send "images" and to webcam with them and to talk as explicitly as they like, not untill they meet the child in person has a crime been committed - by which time it may be too late. Even if the predator is caught at the time of the encounter, the child is already tainted - as responsible professional web-workers we need to do all we can to stop this - I know we never will but we can keep kids safer through education.

www.lemurLoops.com has never pretended to be a child friendly website - it is there to educate parents who need to be wise enough and mature enough to be sickened by what they never want to think about - that this could happen to them, to their children - we advise not to ban kids from the net but rather to teach them to use it responsibly, and in their presence and to openly talk about what they might see or hear online.

To say MySpace etc is not a danger to children is absurd. Would you put your child in any enviroment which had just one peado let alone 90,000? Why else would MySpace ban 90,000 known sex offenders from it's site - how many are not known? To say children shouldn't be on it in the first place is quite naive too - would you say to a victim of a paedophile "Tough luck kid, you should be watching Barney anyway" - not at all, just because Bebo says you must be 13 to join doesn't turn kids off - they think it's cool, their friends have a page, they want one too - we can't make kids play by the rules but we can try keep them safe and use these sites responsibly.

Let's also not forget, the site also explains netlingo, chatrooms, social networking P2Ps and a whole minefield of stuff that parents and teachers just don't know about. My own parents for example wouldn't know how to turn on a computer but happily watch my younger sister play away, alone in her room, to her heart's content - scary huh?

On our resources page we have links to many government supported websites which are aimed at children from countries such as America, Australia and the UK. http://www.lemurloops.com/resources.php

By using scare tactics we are just coming at a different angle from all of the "friendlier" sites and like I say, if just one parents sits up and takes notice, then happy days, maybe 1 less victim.

While I'm here I'l also invite any web-professional to write their own article for our guest writer's blog to have it posted. Links can be found for such with email addresses etc or write directly on the blog

Thanks in advance
 

Byron

New Member
uSwitch247(DOT)com,

I would still not link directly to your website due to the nature of what we want to do withmy clients, promote the use of the internet openly to deliver messages, without fear, only awareness.

In saying that I appreciate you have a cause and wish you luck with it.

Certainly if you have any questions, or anything you want to ask me in relation to how people use the internet, etc. I have talked on licensed radio before and I would consider myself an advocate for safe, yet unrestrictive internet usage in an enviroment which promotes with caution; the use of the internet, rather than breathing fear into parents.

Therefore, send me personal message if you have any questions I might be able to answer for your website. On the point of Bebo and Myspace, I would agree they will be on them. I was on online discussion forums before I was 13 all those years ago, never once had an issue. In saying that I do have one distant friend who suffered abuse as a child (in recent times) so I am compassionate to the cause you are promoting. I tend to agree with awareness being important, but rather the awareness of how to keep safe, rather than publicising individual cases which make things too personal.
I do, however, feel I could link or syndicate much of the terminology sections.

All that said, feel free to personal message me if you want to talk a little more on the topic, I am happy to comment here, but certainly it would be easier to communicate specifics by that method.
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
links

Hi Byron

please feel free to link to any of the sections on www.lemurLoops.com especially the free parental control software - I might add though that it is not for Vista users so if anyone knows of a free programme for vista please send me the link

I will also PM you a small survey

regards
 

mneylon

Administrator
Staff member
In any case there already is legislation to deal with a lot of this sort of thing. For example section 3(4) of the Criminal Law (Human Trafficking) Act 2008.....
where acts defined as "sexually exploiting" a child (defined as person under 18 years)
(d) inviting, inducing, or coercing the child to engage in or participate in any sexual, indecent or obscene act or
(e) (as above) .. forcing the child to observe such acts for the purpose of corrupting or depraving the child
are an offence.
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
"this sort of thing"

Indeed there are laws to deal with this "sort of thing" but the internet is a whole new ball game a people who have been charged with " a sort of" grooming have walked freely thanks to clever lawyers because I's have not been dotted and T's not crossed

Please sign the petition on www.lemurLoops.com to make "grooming" a criminal offence
 

mneylon

Administrator
Staff member
If there are laws already in place they should be used. Introducing new legislation is a waste of time and energy.

I also find it highly questionable that you would wish to collect supposed reports of abuse.

Hotline.ie already exists and people should be encouraged to work with them

Hotline.ie already has a facility for people to _securely_ report alleged cases of grooming etc.,
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
not helpful

hmmm, this is a bit tedius now

If we didnt introduce legislation when new offence come into the equation - such as the internet - we's dtill be in 19-0-splash

Hotline is there for the reporting of "suspect" websites

Hotline may try to have sites banned but they don't - simple as that - I have tried it with them - I have reproted sites, not even got an acknowledgement and the sites are still live some 6 months later

We are not there to ban sites but rather report suspected paedophiles, we have contacts in place to work with the gardai - we will not participate in any investigations except be an access point for parents or children who don't know where to report such

Please feel free not to sign the petition - but you have nothing to be suspicious of - please do not taint us with sly remarks - they are not helpful
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
great

great - so potential victims have somewhere else to report suspected paedophiles......................

I reckon every site should have a REPORT ABUSE BUTTON or at least a link to one

We all know the dangers of the internet, we all need to take a stance and at least make an effort to keep kids safe
 

Forbairt

Teaching / Designing / Developing
Hi uswitch ... are ye a registered charity ? with councellors capable of handling the abuse reports ?

Where are the contact details on the site ?

As I'm seeing nothing of a legal nature on the site I would strongly recommend people steer clear ?

When you get those issues sorted out I'll be happy to go through the site and comment ... in the mean time maybe try getting involved with hotline like suggested :)
 

uSwitch247.com

New Member
me good man....

No Forbairt

we are not a registered charity - nor do we act as one or pretend to be one, neither do we look for money

FYI - I am actually a councillor and I work solely with children - I will PM you the details of who I volunteer with if you like.

uSwitch's details are there if anybody wants to get in touch, we do seek people ringing for counselling because I would rather leave it to the people we will send the reports onto.

I will also repeat that we will not get involved with complaints of abuse other than pass on the details to the gardai, with whom we have processes in place.

The information on the site is a guide for parents with regards the internet, what is a chatroom, a P2P, a social network etc etc - why do we need legalities?

If you want to wait untill "your" proposals are in place before looking at the site, how do you know there are no contact details or legal practices?

What do you have against educating parents on keeping children safe?
 

Forbairt

Teaching / Designing / Developing
Thats good to hear ...

Your Report Abuse: Besafe form asks a lot of personal details there doesn't seem to be a disclaimer

So person XYZ signs up ... on there and then a month later finds the details posted all over the net ? not saying you will but there are no legal disclaimers on there that I can see ... How do I say this ... I checked the 3 ish obvious places ... the footer ... the about page ... and the contact page ... none showed me contact details

You mention uswitchgroup in there somewhere yes ? you don't mention business numbers and so on.

I'm just saying ... on the one hand you take peoples details but you don't provide any assurances on there do you

That said I could probably say some of the same things about A Woman's Heart Galway - Charity offering support, advocacy and networking for women in Galway and I should probably get back to them about it. I do however know where their offices are and who they work with so I've got that going for me / them.

Anyways .. they were my personal thoughts I posted ... nowhere on the site do I see details of your degrees / courses taken / experience to become a councillor ... I'm just saying you're asking some pretty personal questions on there so ... hmm ... ah anyways ... its been one of those days ... take my advice or don't ... what do I know :D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top